nbumgardner 2023-04-29 04:59
Submitted!
Foon → Ludum Dare Explorer → LD53 → Volleyball Returns Game - Physical Rules Edition
By nbumgardner
| Category | Rank | Score | Count | |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Overall | 2.75 | 6 | ||
| Fun | 2.50 | 6 | ||
| Innovation | 3.75 | 6 | ||
| Theme | 2.25 | 6 | ||
| Graphics | 2.00 | 6 | ||
| Humor | 1.75 | 6 | ||
| Mood | 2.37 | 6 |
Submitted!
Hard to test this solo. I expected a video game.
@lord-byte thanks for the feedback! For a solo experience I recommend counting how many turns you can keep the volleyball in the air as your high score.
I agree it is unconventional to submit a board game instead of a video game. So, I tried to label the title and description clearly and keep the rules as simple as possible since the players have to remember them instead having of a computer referee.
Hey, I'm trying to play the game but I'm not sure I totally understand the rules 7, let's say I have this configuration: LDGame.jpg
White is shooting to (2;4), so 2nd line 2nd column, does that mean I just need to move the black at the top right one tile down to have a "straight line that ends on the volleyball"? (Either that or moving black on column 6 up, the one of 5 down and the one on 3 up?)
I didn't know we can make a physical game for Ludum dare! I really like the concept, although it's not easy to try. A suggestion for next time, provide some file that can be printed at home to help setup the game.
@xwilarg good question. “… contiguous line without gaps …” in rule 7 means the 3 character tokens have to form a chain touching each other. So if the volleyball is landing in the center row, then the only winning moves are pretty limited.
When the volleyball lands on row 3,4 column 2 like you have, then the character pieces would need to occupy columns 2 & 3 & 4 of that row 3,4.
In the spirit of real volleyball it’s OK for your pieces to move 1 square off the board as long as you don’t cross the net, it just makes it extra hard to return the next serve. As long as the 3 character pieces make a chain of 3 touching in a straight line, and the volleyball is NOT landing on the middle of the 3 characters, then the interception is successful.
Thanks for posting a picture of your board, it’s great to see another person trying it out!
@quentinverlhac great idea, I think a single-sided PDF for the board would be helpful. The rules PDF intentionally does not exceed 2 sides to make it easier to print and give me a constraint to encourage a tight, simple rule set.
If I had more time I would also have liked to include pictures of example board states, and maybe rename rows to A, B, C.
I always appreciate a physical jam game! My partner and I had some good fun playing it.
Overall it wasn't bad, but maybe just kind of bland. The amount of decisions players get to make isn't very high, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. This feels like the kind of game my dad would have taught me to play during a long road trip or vacation.
It would definitely help to have an extra page in the rules which is simply a pre-drawn board and maybe some cutout character pieces. We didn't have a chess/checkers/go board handy, and drawing the board on paper was kind of painstaking.
Some notes in no particular order: - We were a bit confused about the serving zone. Is the whole serving zone considered one big "square", i.e. you can move from the serving zone to any of the three adjacent field squares? Or is it divided into 3 squares itself, and if so, can you choose where exactly to place your server? - Steps 3 and 5 need to be refactored into one step. Being told to "roll both dice", and then referring to a "first" and "second" die is confusing. Which one is considered "first" if we rolled both at once? Do we get to choose? Or should we be rolling the dice one at a time? We decided to roll one dice at a time, but we think it'd be more fun to get to choose after rolling both dice. - Step 4 shouldn't be a "step", as it is just flavor. It's also splitting up rules 3 and 5 which makes them hard to follow. - Step 5 refers to an "X axis" and a "Y axis", but these terms are never defined. The board setup refers to "rows" and "columns", so I think Step 5 should also refer to rows and columns. Otherwise players might have disagreement about which axis is which. In the example board photo, the columns appear as the X axis, but when you're playing the game, the board is rotated. - Step 6 should clarify whether or not diagonal movement is allowed. We assumed not. - Can a single piece move twice in one turn, taking 2 of your 3 moves? Our interpretation of the rules ("move up to 3 of their pieces one space") is that you cannot do this, each piece only moves at most once per turn. It would help if this was made super explicit. - Our interpretation of the text, "3 pieces in a straight, contiguous line without gaps", is that the pieces need to be orthogonally adjacent, but it would help to clarify whether or not diagonal connections are allowed. - In a comment you mention, "In the spirit of real volleyball it’s OK for your pieces to move 1 square off the board", but I couldn't find this in the rules anywhere. Our interpretation of the board description seemed to imply that you can't move outside of the specified rows, and the only extra column is the serving zone. - We had several long sequences of bouncing back and forth without needing to move any pieces. The long, narrow board also means that keeping your pieces in a straight line down the middle row is a highly effective strategy.
@alchemic thanks for the feedback! All diagonals are allowed, so other than that your assumptions are correct.
**Q1:** Is the whole serving zone considered one big _square_?
**A1:** The rules do not specify, except that you get to decide exactly where to place your starting positions, including your server. The intention is that there is a ring of extra squares around the board, and the serving area is the 3 squares to the left or right of the outermost column. But if all players agree to combine the serving squares into one area and never move off of the board except to start in the serving area, then that is perfectly fine.
**Q2:** Which one [die] is considered _first_ if we rolled both at once?
**A2:** The rules do not specify. When using digital dice read them left to right, when using real dice roll them one at a time. The first/left die determines the column, while the second/right die determines the row. You may also use differently colored dice.
**Q3:** Do we get to choose [dice order]?
**A3:** Officially no, you cannot control where the volleyball lands. However I was playtesting on Twitch yesterday and after the first couple points were scored, we increased the dice to 3 dice and let the active player choose 2 dice to be used in any order, which sped up the number of turns but slowed down each turn because the players had more decisions to think about per-turn. A second suggestion was to roll 2 pairs of dice and pick one pair. In my opinion players should learn the game as written and playtest one full game point before introducing more control over the volleyball in this way.
**Q4:** Step 4 shouldn’t be a “step”, as it is just flavor.
**A4:** True, that is good feedback. The step is flavor, but was intended to help give more context for players to understand the transition between active players and notice the net. I think the flavor and motivation could have been better moved into a 3-6 sentence summary at the start of the rules, then tighten up the real rules below.
**Q5:** I think Step 5 should also refer to rows and columns.
**A5:** I totally agree, replacing `X axis` with `rows` and `Y axis` with `columns` would be better, I missed that inconsistency.
... continued below ...
... continued from above ...
**Q6:** Step 6 should clarify whether or not diagonal movement is allowed.
**A6:** Diagonals are allowed, so mentioning it in the rules would definitely help out.
**Q7:** Can a single piece move twice in one turn, taking 2 of your 3 moves?
**A7:** No, you cannot combine moves onto one character piece. If this was clarified more, then I think I would also re-state that you do not have to use up all of your movement either, thus the `up to` phrasing.
**Q8:** Our interpretation of the text, _3 pieces in a straight, contiguous line without gaps_, is that the pieces need to be orthogonally adjacent.
**A8:** No, all diagonals and orthogonals are allowed, as long as the line is straight without any bends in it, and no gaps between the 3 pieces.
**Q9:** The board description seemed to imply that you can’t move outside of the specified rows, and the only extra column is the serving zone.
**A9:** Correct. Officially the rules do not say either way, mostly because moving a piece off of the board feels like a last resort that would probably make your next receiving turn more difficult, so it probably would not extend the game length very much. Trying to explain the board being larger than 12x3 and with 2 kinds of special zones felt too challenging to fit into a double-sided PDF of rules. Given more time I think a print-able board would make it easier to allow a more complex court to show that the ball lands in the 12x3 area but character pieces may move in a 14x5 area as long as they stay on their half of the net.
**Q10:** We had several long sequences of bouncing back and forth without needing to move any pieces. The long, narrow board also means that keeping your pieces in a straight line down the middle row is a highly effective strategy.
**A10:** Thanks for sharing the strategy!
@alchemic thank you both for playing! Your stories helps me to find the fun, unclear, and interesting bits to iterate upon in this beginner-friendly game.